- Val FAQs
Editors note:
A word of caution is appropriate. Many of the threads in the Nats Project
message board tend to digress more than the threads on other message boards. The
reader is advised to check the other threads in the Nats Project when looking
for information about a specific topic such as paint schemes or specific
aircraft types.
ZUIKAKU Val [EII-206]/Censorship *PIC*
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
Date: Saturday, 28 October 2000, at
9:00 a.m.
One of the most often published, yet
erroneously depicted, Pearl Harbor attack aircraft is ZUIKAKU D3A1 Val
[EII-206] Hokoku-525.
Juzo NAKAMURA, Japanese historian and
researcher interviewed a former employee of the Asahi Shimbun in 1968. Among
the many photographs released by the IJN for publication presented to NAKAMURA
was that of VAL [EII-206]. Upon thorough inspection of the original, it was
revealed that a naval censor had carefully gone over the shotai cho horizontal
white command stripe on the vertical tail surfaces with black ink leaving a
thin white outline of the original stripe on the photograph! Two tell-tale
indicators were the shadow of the white stripe along the rudder hinge line and
the lack of any tonal differences in the surface of the black stripe in this
region. But the most obvious sign that the censor had been at work was that he
had carried the ink beyond the trailing edge of the rudder! Why the censor
sought to change the apparent color of the command stripe still remains a
mystery!
[Editors note: The image is not
replicated in the FAQs]
Re:Val [EII-206] Full Photo *PIC*
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
Date: Saturday, 28 October 2000, at
9:04 a.m.
In Response To: ZUIKAKU Val
[EII-206]/Censorship *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
This is the full photo of ZUIKAKU Val
[EII-206].
Photo via Juzo NAKAMURA.
[Editors note: The image is not
replicated in the FAQs]
Re:Val [EII-206] Full Photo
Posted By: Mike Quan <MnkQuan@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Sunday, 29 October 2000, at 9:38
a.m.
In Response To: Re:Val [EII-206] Full
Photo *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
Would you care to speculate if the
wheel spats are red or black, with either a gray or white flash? Or is this
more of the wartime censor at work? I am sure Bill Sanborn would be interested
if he were to do this bird for the collection. Thanks in advance for yor
insightful analysis.
Re:Val [EII-206] Full Photo
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
Date: Sunday, 29 October 2000, at
10:21 a.m.
In Response To: Re:Val [EII-206] Full
Photo (Mike Quan)
Thanks for the kudo, however my
speculation may not be worth more than anyone else's!
It is hard to tell. This area is in
shadow. Without seeing another view of this bird, but based on practice at the
time, my estimate is that the spats are the same color as the Val and the spat
stripes are white (going all the way around the leading edge and not
"diamond faceted"). But, again, I do not really know!
Perhaps David AIKEN does know or have
another photo which might help resolve this question.
Re:Val [EII-206] Full Photo
Posted By: Bill Sanborn <bsanborn@psemc.com>
Date: Monday, 30 October 2000, at 8:03
p.m.
In Response To: Re:Val [EII-206] Full
Photo (James F. Lansdale)
Thanks for the info and a good catch
on the censor, as well Jim, as in fact this is the bird I plan to do (if I can
duplicate the presentation markings).
FWIW here is my opinion on the
subject. I've been looking to resolve these very questions. FAOW 33 has the
photo of EII-206 on page 42. (Can some one please translate the caption, it
may help). My original interpretation of the photo was similar to Jim's,
however, after looking over the photo (and admittedly liking the dark spats),
the contrast of the light/dark is very sharp, while the contrast of the white
bands on the fuselage is less distinct (even in the underside shadow) This
makes me lean toward a dark color on the spats, but is not conclusive. Aiken,
et al. in "Pearl Harbor & 101 Aircraft", Replica 1/90 (if I have
interpreted the kanji correctly) and Peter Scott in "The Hawaiian
Operation," SAMI v.21 n.12 give the spats as red. On the other hand, the
FAOW and MA 378 have them the same color as the rest of the plane. ??????? A
toss up or dealer's choice from these references. The red certainly makes a
better modelling subject even if it is not historically accurate.
The diamond flash is also ambiguous in
this photo, however a photo of EII-203 (FAOW 33 P. 37) appears to have the
diamond flash (with the points meeting in front) clearly on one spat and less
distinctly on the other. Some of the Val units certainly had different style
(or no) spat flashes within the unit, so just because one plane had it does
not mean another did. I will likely go with the diamond shape for aesthetics
until other info surfaces.
Other questions I have are:
First off, were there stores on the
wing racks? Based on a photo dated 12/8/41 (the Japanese date of PH) of
AII-250 (Kaga) taking off (FAOW 33 p., 34) I would say that only the main load
was carried. However, this may not have been true for all Val's.
Secondly, do the presentation markings
go over the fuselage stripes or do the stripes stop at the markings? They
appear to stop at the markings to me, but others have drawn the profile with
the markings over the bands.
Thirdly, there appear to be hints of
two stripes above the EII-206 on the fin in the FAOW print. Are these real or
remnants of the censor or printing process on the photo.
All help appreciated,
Re:Val [EII-206] Full Photo
Posted By: Grant Goodale <grant.goodale@sympatico.ca>
Date: Tuesday, 31 October 2000, at
7:31 a.m.
In Response To: Re:Val [EII-206] Full
Photo (Bill Sanborn)
In correspondence that I have had with
David Aitken, he indicated that PH Vals (second wave at least) had the
underwing bomb racks removed. However, the diagrams in the Replica document
show that the attachment points for the racks were still present. This makes
sense since the attachment mechanism was probably integral with the wing
structure to provide the required strength.
Re:Val [EII-206] Full Photo
Posted By: Mike Quan <MnkQuan@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Tuesday, 31 October 2000, at
6:04 a.m.
In Response To: Re:Val [EII-206] Full
Photo (Bill Sanborn)
I have some of my own thoughts with
regards to your 'other' questions:
1) Everything I have seen shows just
the bomb load carried on the belly of the PH Vals.
2) I think it would be logical for the
stripes to stop short of the presentation markings. (I think there is a
picture of this somewhere that escapes me now). Wouldn't it be somewhat
sacrilidgeous to somewhat obscure the presentation logo with the distracting
stripes?
Pearl Harbor Val Colors: Update *PIC*
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
Date: Sunday, 29 October 2000, at 9:32
a.m.
The research on the actual color of
the Aichi D3A1 Vals used in the attack on Pearl Harbor goes frustratingly
slow!
The dive brake assembly from the KAGA
Val (shown in the photo below) is the only known relic to be examined in the
condition it was when recovered in December 1941. The preliminary FS match is
that it is close to a semi-gloss color between FS-24201 and FS-16160 (hard to
describe) and WITHOUT any primer undercoat! In two weeks, this relic is
scheduled to be released by the family of the owner for colorimetric, x-ray,
infra-red, and x-ray analysis by the Smithsonian Institution's Conservation
Analysis Laboratory. A full report of their findings will be made on this
site.
In the meantime, I will post a color
comparison on the following message (Pearl Harbor Val Colors, Part 2)
illustrating the weather remains of Aichi D3A1 Val s/n 3392 recovered by Dr.
Charles DARBY. Of course it is likely that this color has faded and or shifted
and it has been rendered non gloss by the elements. There is NO primer
undercoat in evidence. This Val was painted overall in this paint by Aichi.
The top surfaces appeared to have been field-applied in a color much like
FS-34052.
[Editors note: The image is not
replicated in the FAQs]
Re: Pearl Harbor Val Colors: Part 2 *PIC*
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
Date: Sunday, 29 October 2000, at 9:50
a.m.
In Response To: Pearl Harbor Val
Colors: Update *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
The Aichi plant continued to apply a
light color (without primer) to D3A1 Vals as late as April 1942. The following
photo of a well-weathered relic as found by Dr. Charles DARBY in the Solomon
Is. Its present color is between FS-30277 and FS-x6350. The top surfaces had a
field applied dark-green finish similar to FS-34052. This sample is from an
Aichi D3A1 Val s/n3392 constructed in April 1942.
It may be that Aichi used a similar
color during the earlier time frame on Vals used in the Pearl Harbor attack.
Certainly this lighter color, (probably close to FS-24201/16160 when freshly
applied) would have been appropriate as an lower surface color of Vals used at
Midway.
[Editors note: The image is not
replicated in the FAQs]
Re: Pearl Harbor Val Colors: Part 2
Posted By: Greg Springer <gspring@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sunday, 29 October 2000, at
12:31 p.m.
In Response To: Re: Pearl Harbor Val
Colors: Part 2 *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
30277 is Testors Model Master Enamel
'Armor Sand', stock # 1704. I am looking at it as a possible component for a
16350
EI-204 spat design *PIC*
Posted By: David_Aiken <David_Aiken@hotmail.com>
Date: Sunday, 29 October 2000, at 9:58
a.m.
EI-204, caught here as the plane went
quickly by the movie camera, shows its spat design...the red "4" is
out of focus on the spat foward/above the point of the red "arrow"
design. This is the same design seen on another Fifth CV Division VAL:
EII-203.
[Editors note: The image is not
replicated in the FAQs]
Re: EI-204 spat design
Posted By: Bill Sanborn <bsanborn@psemc.com>
Date: Monday, 30 October 2000, at 8:15
p.m.
In Response To: EI-204 spat design *PIC*
(David_Aiken)
Great photo! Is it published and where
can I find it?
However, is this EI-204 (Shokaku) or
EII-204 (Zuikaku)? The reson I ask is that in "PH & 101
Aircraft", the profiles show EI-204 with a wrap around wedge and EII-204
with no flash.
Re: FOUR spat designs on 7 Dec
Posted By: David_Aiken <David_Aiken@hotmail.com>
Date: Tuesday, 31 October 2000, at
9:00 a.m.
In Response To: Re: EI-204 spat design
(Bill Sanborn)
When "Shinjuwan no 101 Ki"
(Pearl Harbor & 101 Aircraft) was printed in Jan 1990 REPLICA, I saw that
H. Yoshimura had placed, as you describe, "a wrap around wedge" on
EI-204. So I sent to him a video tape [that a local TV station made from film
I own] that shows Lt (JG) Iwakichi Mifuku's EI-204 on takeoff on a LATER
mission (not Pearl Harbor).
The camera shows the spat marking
first then as the plane passes then the tail is in focus, then the entire
plane (with wing rack bombs which were NOT used on any VAL on 7 Dec) is shown
leaving the deck [a still is shown in Stan Cohen's EAST WIND RAIN, page 90].
Four stills were then printed in
REPLICA Jul 1992, when we reprinted the original article, along with an
addendum giving photos, corrections, additions, deletions, and yet reassuring
our readers that the Model Art of Oct 1991 has errors (just like we had) which
were not addressed. This is why I am most interested in the Model Art
"update" that has just been released this month.
Of interest to spats, there are FOUR
styles used at Pearl Harbor: The diamond "arrow", the (as you aptly
described) wrap around wedge, and the "Akagi VAL" style. A fourth
style appeared in our article on Saburo Makino's AII-250 [see page 147 in
Model Art Oct 91] where the BULK from that CV used a different
"standard". This is now known to be found on Soryu BI-259, too.
Model Art's artist S. Nohara has placed this on other Soryu VALs as a
"standard". Of interest, Hiryu BII-214 had the wrap around wedge.
Some photos were found without any
spat design at all, but these are pre-war shots which suggests that the deck
crew had not gotten to them. Note the absence of portside "AII-" on
Kaga KATE "352" over Oahu, and the difference in serifs (one side
versus the other) on AI-154 at the crash site, in both cases where the deck
crew had not completed the painting yet it was in operation. THUS we showed
the absence of spat marking as a possibility in combat at Pearl. There are
others, for which we had in our article at the time, no confirmed knowledge of
the spat design and left it blank, which we now know more.
AII-250 IS Saburo Makino's VAL. His
crash photos on 7 Dec 1941 include the digits "50". Of interest,
there was only ONE "Hikotaicho" (Air Group CO) VAL on Kaga, while
Model Art artist S. Nohara says there were three.
Again, there was only one "Hikotaicho"
marked VAL on Akagi: artist S. Nohara has Lt Zenji Abe (a buntaicho) flying
"Hikotaicho" marked AI-201, when he only flew THAT plane once in the
Indian Ocean action when the Hikotaicho, Lt Takehiko Chihaya, was ill...which
S. Nohara has Chihaya flying AI-251 in error. Be careful with the S. Nohara
artwork in the Model Art #378. Oh yes, Takehiko Chihaya's younger brother has
written a host of books on the Japanese Navy and its warships!
Re: FOUR spat designs on 7 Dec
Posted By: Bill Sanborn <bsanborn@psemc.com>
Date: Tuesday, 31 October 2000, at
9:13 a.m.
In Response To: Re: FOUR spat designs
on 7 Dec (David_Aiken)
Thanks for the fantastic data! It is
much appreciated and informative! Looks like I have to find the 1992 Replica.
I too am interested in the new MA. HLJ is listing it as prepared for shipment
so I hope to have it in a couple of weeks.
Do you have an opinion on the spat
color of EII-206?
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