IJN Markings
 
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <mailto:LRAJIM@aol.com?subject=IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Thursday, 17 August 2000, at 5:10 a.m.
 
The first reference to Japanese victory markings being applied to IJN fighters appears in "Samurai!".
According to Fred SAITO (and, later, Martin CAIDIN) Saburo SAKAI stated," My own victory over the Soviet fighter soon overcame the dejection caused by my poor combat performance. The day following the flight I lost no time in painting a blue star on the fuselage of the Claude fighter, for a total of six stars on the airplane." ("Samurai!," SAKAI et al, p.41)
Many questions regarding this alleged statement by SAKAI-san have remained and its accuracy is dubious at best. The earliest photographically verifiable use of victory markings being applied to IJN fighters appears in illustrations found in the "A6M Zero In Action," pages 9 and 15. The use of blue/red (?) origami bird silhouettes (p.9) was a substantiated practice on 12 kaigun kokutai Zeros during the "China Incident."
 
To my knowledge, the use of sakura as victory markings during the early campaigns of the Pacific is substantiated in only one photograph of a 3 ku A6M2 Zero [X-183] (p.15). Strangely, other than artists' renderings, there are no photographically verifiable applications of victory markings on IJN aircraft from this one example cited above (in early 1942) until the home defense efforts began on the Japanese mainland in late 1944.
Does anyone have any certain documentation that the IJN applied any victory markings to naval aircraft in the southern and central Pacific campaigns?
Thank you for any help or comments on this question.
Jim Lansdale
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Elephtheriou George <mailto:elgeorge@otenet.gr?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Thursday, 17 August 2000, at 2:13 p.m.
 
In Response To: IJN Victory Markings (James F. Lansdale)
 
Lansdale sama e and everybody else too,
(I'm beginning to get old and my vision is poor. Or I need a new set of glasses. Or I need to remember to clean them from time to time)
Now if somebody can make out what exactly are the 2 killing markings of 3-136 of MA 510 page 154, I would surely appreciate it. Also, MA 510 page 107, the 3-173.
Same book, page 211. NI-112, very interesting "star" killing marking.
thank you
George
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <mailto:LRAJIM@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Thursday, 17 August 2000, at 9:07 p.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (Elephtheriou George)
 
Hi George
Thank you for observing the "star" kill marking on the 802 ku Rufe. I missed that one!
Re: "Now if somebody can make out what exactly are the 2 killing markings of 3-136 of MA 510 page 154, I would surely appreciate it. Also, MA 510 page 107, the 3-173." I believe they are all the little origami birds I referred to before.
 
Jim Lansdale
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: scott scarborough <mailto:crusader117@juno.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Friday, 18 August 2000, at 8:11 p.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (James F. Lansdale)
 
Is it possible that these marking designs were just the whim of the pilot or unit the plane was attached to? There does not seem to be a strict regulation for the application of "kill" markings. CPO Tanimizu of the Fighter Hikotai 303 unit had American national markings (without the bars) with a single arrow through each, painted on the port side of his A6M-5. In the book "Japanese Naval Aces and Fighter Units in World War II" (Hata and Izawa) shows some fuzzy photos of aircraft with different styles of victory markings, from China to the Pacific. Scott
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Cruiser K <mailto:cruiserk@wans.net?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Friday, 18 August 2000, at 9:29 p.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (scott scarborough)
 
Hello Scott,
It does appear that it varied from Unit to Unit on how or if Japanese Air Groups would show or display kill markings.
The kill markings on Tanimizu's A6M really stand out and set it apart from others. The plane not only displays U.S. markings with arrows through them it also displays silhouettes of two B-29's head on. Tanimizu also piloted another A6M that had Kanji Japanese text on the plane claiming a downed B-24. This inscription served to encourage novice pilots that flew with him. Similar markings with U.S. insignia with arrow trough it appears on Yokosuka Air Group Gekko. With this in mind I see no reason why kill markings would not appear on Claudes as early as China as appeared in the book Samurai. As you mentioned other units used cherry blossoms, tomahawk hatchets, and origami birds. I have seen illustrations but I am not too sure of Air Group 343 Naoshi Kanno's George depicted with silhouette of B-29's with X marked trough them, this has not been proven and may be fictitious.
 
Sincerely,
Cruiser K
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Rob Graham <mailto:reishikisenguy@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Thursday, 17 August 2000, at 5:51 a.m.
 
In Response To: IJN Victory Markings (James F. Lansdale)
 
Jim:
Funny you ask, I think you may have something here! I'll get my eyes looking, too, and see what I can see. Real quick, how about the A6M2 kit decals of (was it???) Iwamoto's plane? I'm drawing a blank about the pilot, but it's the one with the left side of the fuselage with the billboard-sized bank of cherry blossoms.
Now that you say this, I am not recalling any photos of such a scheme. I may be way off base.
Anyway, I'll look and see what I can see to check it out.
 
--Rob
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Sander Kingsepp <mailto:sander.kingsepp@neti.ee?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Saturday, 19 August 2000, at 7:36 a.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (Rob Graham)
 
Yes, according to Tamiya the billboard belonged to WO Iwamoto (A6M2 with the tailcode 253-102) stationed in Rabaul (January 1944).
Speaking about Sakai's Claude. . . I was searching for this quote in my Japanese version (100th print, Kojinsha 1982) - in vain.
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <mailto:LRAJIM@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Thursday, 17 August 2000, at 6:22 a.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (Rob Graham)
 
Hi Rob
I think you are correct, that NOHARA-san has illustrated this "left side of the fuselage with the billboard-sized bank of cherry blossoms" all nice and pink! This is based on the pilot's account.
I also located an A6M2-N Rufe [N1-118] of 802 ku with three "hatchet" victory marks in MA No.510, p.108 and "A6M Zero In Action," p.48, which I had forgotten about!
 
Jim Lansdale
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Rob Graham <mailto:reishikisenguy@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Thursday, 17 August 2000, at 11:31 a.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (James F. Lansdale)
 
Yes, I think there are a few Rufe shots with victories, but in initial checking this morning, I saw your theory holds true so far. In the Model Art on IJN fighter camo and markings (MA 510? Forgot number, am at work), several different markings are shown, but not in photos.
Possibly, could the censors have eradicated them? I see one shot where it looks like they did
 
--Rob
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: James Holloway <mailto:fholl46282@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Friday, 18 August 2000, at 12:38 a.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (Rob Graham)
 
Sirs, I think all the zeroes of the 12th had the origami bird in a circle as a standard kill marking. I have seen photos of six of these pilots standing under the tails, codes and kills are visible. I have a small photo showing Matsuo Hagiri painting one onto his plane's tail. He is the same pilot that flew the Claude with the black bands that everyone is familiar with. I asked Sakai Saburo about the kill marks on the Claude and he sad definitely no. He does recall a lot of his experiences quite well as he is always taking notes and upgrading his old files. He's a pretty good artist ,too. While we were discussing the Colin Kelly incident he did a sketch of a Natori class cruiser that was instantly recognizable. There is also a second pilot at Rabaul that carried cherry blossom kills on the fuselage. I have his name, but it's not with me at this time and is similar to a pilot's name that survived. Hope this helps. 
 
Sincerely, James Holloway
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: James Holloway <mailto:fholl46282@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Saturday, 19 August 2000, at 2:50 a.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (James Holloway)
 
In regards to the Origami birds of the 12th, they are actually swallows, they symbolize the "Swaallow Cutting" technique of Musashi Miyamoto's most famous opponent, where he would cut swallows out of the air as they flew past them. Knowing a lot of the early pilots look at their planes as Katanas it seems to fit. The circles, besides being artsy, also kept them a uniform size. I don't know wither this story is true or not , but it sounds good and I believed it at the time. 
 
Sincerely, 
James Holloway
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Don Marsh <mailto:marsh44@fuse.net?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Saturday, 19 August 2000, at 1:24 p.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (James Holloway)
 
Hi James;
I found your Musashi Miyamoto's most famous opponent "swallow cutting" story very interesting and highly plausible as it applied to the Japanese pilots. The mythos of samurai legend is, and has always been, a big part of Japanese culture, much like the western is for America.
Additional information regarding the swallow that some of the folks here at the J-aircraft board might find of interest...
The respect the swallow has been accorded throughout oriental culture in general is reflected in the popularity of this bird as a motif or namesake. It is said that the swallow flies far and fast and always returns. In the book of the great Chinese philosopher Chuang Tzu dating from the 2nd c. BC, it is said "There is no bird wiser than the swallow." Consequently, the speed, agility, endurance, intelligence and homing instinct of this small bird made it a popular subject in Japanese aviation. The Kawasaki Ki 61 "Hien" was named after it. Also, being a recon unit, the 2nd Flying Regiment very fittingly utilized this motif as their unit emblem, portraying the 
swallow in an origami stylization.
 
Don
 
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Rob Graham <mailto:reishikisenguy@aol.com?subject=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Saturday, 19 August 2000, at 9:48 p.m.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (Don Marsh)
 
Don:
Fascinating bit of information. It seems the Germans are also fans of the swallow (Schwalbe), as it is such a nimble bird and whips and zips to eat mosquito's, an especially fine trait that we Texans can appreciate, as many of our mosquito's are like shrimp with wings.
Anyway, I have noticed Americans tend to hold the swallow in low regard, as immortalized in the screenplay of the movie "Mr Hobbs Takes a Vacation" with 
Jimmy Stewart:
"What kind of bird is that??"
(with contempt)"Barn swallow."
As if they were all Mr Hobbs ever saw...
As usual, Don your insight is as refreshing as it is informative!
 
--Rob
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: Stephen Fedor<mailto:sfedor@iopener.net=Re: IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Saturday, 30 January 2001.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (James F. Lansdale)
From an old Air Classics, I ripped out the page with a photo of a Zero in the USAF Museum boneyard.  Only a small photo, but it showed the mid fuselage (and other disassembled sections).  Below the cockpit were indications of "kill" markings.  The photo caption identified some US a/c types as victims, so I suppose the markings were planform silhouettes.  They looked to be 6 in the top row over 4 in the second row.

In 1986 I inquired about it.  The Museum's reply got back to me with color scheme, tail markings, etc but stated that the information was "provisional," that accurate information would have to await restoration.  Evidently, this Zero was victim of an air to ground attack at Kavieng late in the war and was eventually recovered in three major pieces.

From the photo, the Zero did not look like it had any "foreign" markings, like Allied Air Intelligence or graffiti.  The "kill" markings appeared larger than I would have expected, but if they were phony, somebody took some pains to do them.

Perhaps somebody else knows more of the real story but it seems quite likely that kill markings were employed to some extent in the Rabaul area.

Hoping this lead proves useful,

Stephen Fedor
Re: IJN Victory Markings
 
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <mailto:LRAJIM@aol.com?subject=IJN Victory Markings>
Date: Saturday, 30 January 2001.
 
In Response To: Re: IJN Victory Markings (Stephen Fedor)
 
The Nakajima A6M2 model 21 in question is one of two fuselages owned by the USAF Museum in Dayton Ohio.  Don Halls salvaged this particular Zero from New Guinea or the Solomons and subsequently repainted it.  Many years ago, it was on display for a short time in the USAF Museum, but it is now a part of the Zero restoration project in the shop along with parts of another Zero provided by John Sterling.

The white kill markings below the cockpit (plan-form silhouettes of American aircraft with crossed spears over them) are bogus and were added for display purposes.  They were NOT original to this aircraft.

IHTH
Jim Lansdale
Red prop warning stripes
 
Posted By: Andrew Johnson <mailto:ajo@ceh.ac.uk?subject=Red prop warning stripes>
Date: Monday, 31 July 2000, at 4:13 a.m.
 
I hate to bore you all with this, but what tips do people have for doing the twin red warning stripes on the silver propellers of naval aircraft?
 
Thanks
Andrew
 
Re: Red prop warning stripes
 
Posted By: Bill Sanborn <mailto:lotsabooks@msn.com?subject=Re: Red prop warning stripes>
Date: Wednesday, 2 August 2000, at 9:07 p.m.
 
In Response To: Red prop warning stripes (Andrew Johnson)
 
I've used dry transfer railroad striping. it comes in various colors and thickness. I've used it for 1/72, but I am sure it will work for larger. I also saw some of the new Eduard masking film is sold in thin strips. It may be very useful for masking.
 
Bill
 
Re: Red prop warning stripes
 
Posted By: Cruiser K <mailto:cruiserk@wans.net?subject=Re: Red prop warning stripes>
Date: Monday, 31 July 2000, at 1:51 p.m.
 
In Response To: Red prop warning stripes (Andrew Johnson)
 
I have in the past used decals on 1/48" scale models. Some other tips could be to used colored hobby tape. Letraline is one brand and there are other brands that come in different widths. You can probably use the thinnest width that you can find and you still may have to trim this with an x-acto to get the stripes the correct scale. Probably the most realistic looking but the most tedious method would be to paint the stripes on by masking off the propeller blade to the correct width for the stripe. You can use paint brush or air brush. There may be touchup work required after removal of masking tape. These are methods that I might use. Others may have better ideas. I
You may have to do some research to get the stripe the correct scaled down width. Others here may no more.
 
Re: Red prop warning stripes
 
Posted By: Tennessee Katsuta <mailto:kinson-garments@on.aibn.com?subject=Re: Red prop warning stripes>
Date: Monday, 31 July 2000, at 9:31 p.m.
 
In Response To: Re: Red prop warning stripes (Cruiser K)
 
Hi, Andrew.
I usually paint the red first, mask it off with a thin strip of masking tape, and airbrush on the silver.
 
Tennessee
 
Tail Codes
 
Posted By: Justin Baran <mailto:Frieza_79_@hotmail.com?subject=Tail Codes>
Date: Wednesday, 25 July 2001, at 7:47 a.m.
 
Does anybody know of a site that has japanese aircraft tail codes and markings info?
 
Re: Tail Codes
 
Posted By: James F. Lansdale <mailto:LRAJIM@aol.com?subject=Re: Tail Codes>
Date: Wednesday, 25 July 2001, at 5:09 p.m.
 
In Response To: Tail Codes (Justin Baran)
 
Hi Justin
This site (www.j-aircraft.com) has one article on this subject on the homepage under Research.
Go to the link below or return to the J-Aircraft Dot Com Home Page> Research> Unit Prefixes.
This article is in need of updating (particularly the [P1-], [P2-], and [P3-] codes), however, most of the other IJNAF unit-code prefixes are correct.
 
IHTH
Jim Lansdale
 
IJNAF Unit Code Prefixes
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